Frankly, I thought this was already common knowledge, but Icethetics confirmed yesterday that the NHL’s Reverse Retro program, which launched last season but did not return this season, will be revived next season.
The key nugget of info in the Icethetics report is that some teams will be “bending the definition” of ЯR, which sounds like code for “a lot of these designs will have no particular reason to exist, but we need to move more retail product so we’re just gonna throw some shit against the wall and see what sticks.”
For the record, I was a fan of the original ЯR program. My only gripes were (a) it didn’t work so well for some teams, especially the ones that don’t have a deep uni-design history (Red Wings, Leafs, etc.), so some of the unis felt forced, and (b) some of the designs were so good that it made no sense to scrap them after just one season. That second gripe also applies to the NBA’s City program, which I suspect is what ЯR is going to resemble going forward.
There’s already some chatter about what some of the designs will be. The Avs’ version, e.g., will reportedly be based on the old Colorado Rockies (the NHL Rockies, not the MLB Rockies), and I’m sure we’ll be hearing more about other teams’ designs in the weeks and months to come. Stay tuned!
Today’s real lede: Last week on Bulletin I looked at teams that moved but didn’t change their names. The week before that, I looked at teams that changed their names but didn’t move. This week, in the third and final installment of this series, I’m assigning grades to teams that changed their names as the result of a move (like the ones shown above). You can check it out here on Bulletin. Enjoy!
As I recently mentioned, this will be my last Bulletin article that’s publicly available to all. Starting with next week’s article, my Bulletin content will be accessible only to paying subscribers. The price is $4 a month or $35 for a full year. This revenue will also help support operations here on the blog.
You’ll need a Facebook account in order to pay for a subscription (I know, I know). You can sign up for your paid subscription here, although it’s fine if you’d rather wait until the first paywalled article is published next week. And you can learn more about what you’ll get for your money here. Thanks!
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Getting ready for Sunday: With the Rams and 49ers getting set to face off this Sunday in the NFC Championship Game, here’s a great photo of those same two teams facing each other in a 1957 game. I particularly like the Niners’ gold-red-gold sleeve striping (here’s a better look at it), a one-season-only element that I wish they’d bring back.
Meanwhile: Mike Summo, who is quickly developing into one of our most entertaining digital artists, has whipped up a new set of old-school TV graphics for this Sunday’s games (click to enlarge):
In addition, Jason Von Stein has produced his weekly NFL illustration, and it’s a doozy. He actually worked me and the Tugboat Captain into this one — see lower-right (click to enlarge):
I love all of this. Go Niners!
(Big thanks to @jpnoblejr for the 1957 photo.)
ITEM! Pin raffle: Reader Tim Bullis has an extra November 2020 Uni Watch pin and is generously offering it to a lucky reader, so I’m going to raffle it off today.
This will be a one-day raffle. USA mailing addresses only. To enter, send an email with your mailing address to the raffle in-box by 8pm Eastern tonight. One entry per person. I’ll announce the winner tomorrow. Big thanks to Tim for making this one possible!
Meanwhile, Tim also donated the cap that we raffled off yesterday. The winner of that one is Noah White. Big congrats to him!
The Ticker
By Paul
Baseball News: In a seriously gross development, the MLB-partnered Pioneer League has sold the league’s own name to an advertiser. … Our own Brinke Guthrie was watching an episode of the 1970s TV police show The Streets of San Francisco whose storyline included a Giants/Atlanta game at Candlestick. Brinke got screenshots of a ticket stub, guest star Andrew Duggan wearing a Giants cap, and an Atlanta player in the team’s old “feather” uniform (but no batting helmet). … New uniforms for the Double-A Midland RockHounds. … Absolutely spectacular chest script on this 1950 American Legion uni. … The Northwoods League’s Battle Creek Bombers will henceforth be known as the Battle Creek Battle Jacks (thanks to all who shared). … Wayne Gretzky in a No. 99 Dodgers jersey? Sure, why not. … Oh baby, check out this set of early-’70s MLB team posters that Jimmy Lonetti assembled. … New advertised stadium name for the Frontier League’s New York Boulders.
Pro Football News: Following up on an item from yesterday’s Ticker, Illinois State Redbirds men’s basketball team wore BFBS alternates last night. The shorts featured a basketball-playing redbird clearly patterned after an old logo originally used by the NFL’s Chicago Cardinals and St. Louis Cardinals (from @CardsandCustoms). … Ross Hazlett was looking at game-used jerseys worn by Browns QB Baker Mayfield and noticed that they were all tailored with asymmetrical sleeves. “The right side has an actual sleeve, while the left has just a sleeve cap (more like a lineman-type jersey),” he says. “Looking back at other jerseys of his, this seems to be just a 2021 thing, so maybe it had something to do with all the issues he had with his left shoulder.” … Ravens DB Anthony Levine wore a blue collar cosplay outfit to announce his retirement yesterday (from @evanthevoice). … When the revived USFL debuts on April 16, Fox and NBC will simulcast the first game. … Love these vintage Rams and 49ers jersey tags (from John Turney). … Hall of Fame DL Charles Haley played for the 49ers from 1986-91. For most of that time, he wore the team’s standard grey facemask, but there was a period in 1990 when he wore a different mask with a much darker color — not quite black, but close (from Carlos Jalife). … While looking at Haley photos for that last item, I discovered that 49ers DL Jim Burt also had a darker facemask in 1989 — not as dark as Haley’s, but definitely darker than the team’s usual grey. … Say it with me, people: There is no such thing as a “jersey combo.”
Hockey News: Flyers D Keith Yandle became the NHL’s all-time “ironman” on Tuesday night by playing in his 965th consecutive game. He marked the occasion by having “965” printed on his gloves (from Wade Heidt). … Also from Wade: The Canucks wore their gorgeous Lunar New Year pregame jerseys on Tuesday night. There was also a commemorative pregame puck design. … The Caps last night became the latest NHL team to support mental health awareness by wearing a “Hockey Talks” helmet decal. Additional info here (thanks, Jamie). … New BFBS jersey for Alabama’s men’s club team (from Matt Sammon). … Cross-listed from the baseball section: Here’s an old shot of Wayne Gretzky in a Los Angeles Dodgers jersey.
College Hoops News: Cross-listed from the NFL section: The Illinois State Redbirds men’s team wore BFBS alternates last night. The shorts featured a basketball-playing redbird clearly patterned after an old logo originally used by the NFL’s Chicago Cardinals and St. Louis Cardinals (from @CardsandCustoms). … I’m not sure when this photo is from, but it shows Nebraska men’s with four out of five players on the court wearing JrOB (from Carl Hungus). … Ohio State women’s is giving out this very cool “Dribbling Brutus” flag tonight. … Arkansas and Ole Miss men’s went red vs. blue last night (from @HogFlashbacks). … Contrary to — or at least in addition to — what we reported in yesterday’s Ticker, it appears that some NCAA coaches are indeed wearing “Coaches vs. Cancer” sneakers this season (from James Gilbert).
Soccer News: Both teams in yesterday’s Heart of Midlothian/Celtic game in the Scottish Premiership wore warm-up shirts supporting a suicide-prevention charity. The move was prompted by the recent death of a 13-year-old Hearts fan (thanks, Jamie). … A lifestyle brand is highlighting endangered species by creating concept sports teams, beginning with a soccer team whose excellent logo features a pair of birds from Chicago (from Austin Chen). … New home shirt for Brazilian side Palmeiras (from Ed Zelaski).
Grab Bag: Interesting offset numerals for the uni number on this old roller derby uniform (from Ed Kozak). … The UK’s Netball Superleague’s Severn Stars have new kits. “I’m slightly fascinated that the Velcro straps (which the bibs showing the player’s position are attached to) are white on the orange design and black on the black design,” says our own Jamie Rathjen). … Dave Kuruc spotted this nice vintage curling jacket at a Toronto thrift shop. … New police uniforms for Columbus, Ohio. … The Wells Fargo Center in Phily recently hosted eight events in eight days, including games for the 76ers, Flyers, Wings, Villanova hoops, and more. You can see all the makeovers in this fun time-lapse video (from @PhillyPartTwo). … Unusual new city logo for Florence, Ala. Additional details here. … The NLL’s New York Riptide will honor “everyday heroes” with their uniforms on Saturday (from Wade Heidt). … Really interesting article about how new technology is creating enhanced audio of tennis matches so visually impaired fans can still enjoy following the action.
Regarding Charles Haley’s darker grey facemask, it must have been a Kralite material issue where they could only make certain colors based on the plastic making process. If you look at some old Reggie White pictures during his Eagles playing days you’ll see him with the exact same facemask, color and all. My guess is, they were made in plastic molds in base colors whereas traditional masks were painted. I always thought the Kralite facemasks were so ugly and the new Axiom masks resemble them to an extent.
Just to add those Kralite masks were made by Riddell, as was the metal mask worn by Burt. I always assumed with the metal masks Riddell just wanted to use different color gray than what Schutt was using. Also note that both Haley and Burt were wearing Air Power helmets, which would eventually be owned by Schutt – although I just don’t remember the year that original manufacturer Bike spun off the helmet operation; I think it was briefly a stand-alone company before Schutt bought it.
Since Thursdays have traditionally been Indigenous Appropriation Days here at UniWatch, and because I’m an American person of Indigenous heritage, I’ve decided that here and now is where I’d like to share my story;
From my Mother’s side of my family I’m 1/8 Narragansett/Wampanoag Indian + 1/8 Portuguese & 1/8 Black + 1/8 Japanese. From my Father’s side I’m 1/4 Portuguese & 1/8 Irish + 1/8 English.
However, just as much as I am all of those things, I’m also none of those things; I’ve never lived on an Indian Reservation, I’ve never lived in Portugal or on the Azores, and I’ve never lived in Africa, Japan, Ireland, or England. I don’t wear a headdress or live in a tee-pee. I don’t speak Portuguese and I’ve never been on a Nantucket sleigh ride. I’ve never hunted a wildebeest or been chased by a lion. I’ve never worn a kimono and I rarely eat sushi. I don’t have a shamrock tattoo and I’ve never kissed the Blarney Stone. I don’t drink tea and I don’t swear allegiance to Queen Elizabeth II. But, I do drive a giant, gas guzzling SUV through the drive-thru at McDonald’s, I do drink Budweiser Beer, I do drink Jack Daniel’s Whiskey, I do coach youth sports, I do live on a cul-de-sac in a house with a three car garage, and I do work my ass off to provide for my wife and three daughters. I’m an American before I’m anything else. Yet, even though both of my Mother’s parents went to high school in San Francisco (and I lived in San Diego for six months in 2005), I don’t consider myself a Californian. I’m a Bostonian. I grew up in the suburbs of Boston, I went to college in Boston at one of the best schools in the world, and I’m raising my family in the suburbs of Boston. I’ll root for all of the Boston/New England sports teams until the day I die, but on the days they’re not playing, I always have and always will root for all of the teams that invoke a reference to my cultural heritage. As a kid, and still to this day, I’ve always loved the Cleveland Indians and the Chief Wahoo logo (I have an oversized Wahoo embroidered logo mounted on the wall among my sports memorabilia), the Washington Redskins, the Atlanta (Milwaukee/Boston) Braves, and the Kansas City Chiefs. They’re all named in honor of my family. I think that’s fucking amazing!
I don’t get offended by institutionalized racism. If stupid people down south are ignorant enough to raise their children to believe I’m a lesser type of person than them because of the places my ancestors were born, that’s their problem. But, if they believe that because it’s what they were taught when they were young, it’s not really their fault, so I don’t have any interest in feeling bad about it. However, the definition of the word racism, as I understand it, is that it’s the idea that a person or group of people should be treated or considered in a certain way because of their nationality, religion, ancestry, or skin color. It has nothing to do with the idea that those thoughts or actions are negative or positive, just that it’s an idea that a person’s race makes them “different.”
The kind of racism that does bother me is the kind that’s perpetrated by white people who claim they’re trying to help me because I wasn’t lucky enough to be born looking like them. You can all take your lily white opinions and shove them right up your racist assholes, as far as I’m concerned! I like the way that I look. Women fall at my feet and tell me how handsome they think I look with my golden tan in the middle of the winter. Looking like me is 1,000 times better than looking like you, as far as I’m concerned!
Let me have the teams that I love, and mind your own fucking business!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
P.S.: I will not be paying money to read on Facebook about how much you think it sucks to look like me!
Feel better? Wow, you seem like such a great guy. Speaking as a white person born in a southern, deeply red state, just because certain things don’t affect you doesn’t mean that other people aren’t offended or that they aren’t affected by the same things. Realizing this is called empathy. If by your definition, that makes me a racist, I will gladly accept that. Also, I will continue to do whatever I can to make the lives of those that I come into contact with better in whatever way that I can. If that means not appropriating their culture then so be it. I strongly disagree with your opinions and I hope that educate yourself more on the history of the sports teams that you claim to love as well as American history in general.
The point that I take out of this post (and something I’ve tried to articulate many times in this comment section) is that it’s dangerous to assume that negative attitudes toward Native American appropriation are the only position – or even the majority position – held by actual Native Americans. There are native people out there who feel honored by teams named “Eskimos” or “Fighting Sioux”. For example, I think it’s fairly well-known that the man who modeled for the Washington Redskins’ logo was disappointed to see it (and the name associated with it) go. And I remember there was a Ticker link on this blog years ago that talked about Canadian Inuit people who were against the renaming of the Edmonton Eskimos.
Those people do exist, and their feelings should matter too. Do they represent the majority Native American opinion? I don’t know. But it seems like nobody else knows either, and worse, it seems like very few people care. The native people who are against their culture’s appropriation have made their feelings known, and their feelings should absolutely be taken into consideration. But the issue is more nuanced than simply choosing to not offend people with one certain point of view, and that nuance should not be forgotten.
“But the issue is more nuanced than simply choosing to not offend people with one certain point of view, and that nuance should not be forgotten.”
This is certainly true, though Justin’s rant above does this position no favors. There are a number of examples of organizations working together with Native Americans to create logos and iconography that pays tribute to a particular tribe or nation. To me, this seems like a prudent approach, rather than naming a team something generic and native sounding like Braves or Chiefs (or worse, Redskins or Indians) and not caring about how a choice like that might impact people.
Standing up against racism, while simultaneously characterizing everyone in the South as racists and “stupid”. Got it. Friendly advice: decaf.
So, to sum up your post–you’re 1/8th Native American, and your life hasn’t been affected much by racism. Which is probably attributable to your not looking like a minority and not having a minority name, so people treat you as white.
So you want everyone to know that as a minority–but one who passes for white all the time–you think racism is GREAT. I mean, if YOU personally aren’t targeted for your race, surely no one else is!
So what you REALLY don’t like is the way people look at the fact that Native Americans have a higher poverty rate than any other group of Americans and think that somehow racism might be a factor in that. I mean, YOU are successful, so the fact that other people are obviously minorities or are born on reservations–that couldn’t POSSIBLY be a factor!
Similarly, Black households in this country have less than one-tenth the wealth of white households on average, but, to you, the only problem is that someone NOTICED that. After all, if racism doesn’t affect YOU, it couldn’t POSSIBLY affect someone else.
Of course the unsaid implication is that dark-skinned people are to blame for their situation. Of course you’d insist that you don’t think they’re inferior–but you clearly believe they are with all your heart and soul. You make a point of saying how hard you work, with the clear implication that poor people don’t–hey, if you can make it as minority, albeit one who would never be noticed, anyone who can’t must be lazy! I mean, a policeman never kneeled on YOUR neck–so clearly the fact that it happened to a Black man is just coincidence!
Don’t kid yourself. You’re as racist as they come. Own it.
Racism is real. As long as it is, being aware of racism is not just not racist–it’s absolutely necessary.
Well said Brett.
“I went to college in Boston at one of the best schools in the world, ”
” Women fall at my feet and tell me how handsome they think I look…”
Duh.
All Uni Watchers can say the same.
I like those 49ers stripes. Hopefully they bring that design back for at least a game.
Thank you for sharing Paul.
Hope everyone has a great NFL weekend.
Who Dey!
I agree, that sleeve stripe element is really nice. I’ve never noticed that before.
Go Chiefs!
Nobody’s mentioning the 49ers game socks in the photo. They are a mirror image of the sleeve stripes. I’ve seen the jersey before but have never seen the socks. Really a nice look. Wish today’s uni designers had the same taste in matching various stripes (although they don’t seem to like stripes more patches,blocks and splashes of color…horrible)on a uniform that is a perfectly balanced look.
Love this photo, and it’s a reminder of how much I miss jerseys with sleeves.
Yeah, those are nice socks.
I’m surprised the NFL doesn’t sell team socks to wear.
They would need to alter the socks to be a standard length, as I believe most NFL socks are extremely long.
People would totally buy team socks. People love buying socks of any style.
Even in a suit, you could pull it off.
I should note that I’ve been reading UniWatch every Monday through Friday since I first found it on ESPN Page-2. There are plenty of things about it that I will miss about it, but I won’t miss the politics.
The only person talking about politics here is you.
Also, this isn’t an airport, so there’s no need to announce your departure.
+1
What? No love for Phil on the weekends? Sheesh…
Given that Isaiah Roby (seen in the pic) is now in his 3rd NBA season, I’d say that pic of the Nebraska players all with Jrs on their back is at least 4-5 seasons ago.
Looks like it lines up with the 2018-19 roster.
link
You’re right Jay. I the Nebraska vs Oklahoma State game is from December 16, 2018 and played in Sioux Falls, SD.
link
Paul – I hope you continue to tease the Bulletin content here on the blog. I understand and support your decision charge for access but I’m on the fence about paying for it. Getting a sense for each week’s content might push me over the edge.
Yes, I will. Thanks.
Seconded.
Just because I would want to know, regarding the baseball ticker ticket stub, the Giants split the doubleheader (Home games 19 and 20 of the season) with the Braves.
Braves, 4-1.
link;;
Giants, 5-4.
link;;
Great article, Paul. I disagree with the Thrashers to Jets as lazy, though. It’s all Winnipeg had. If a team would move to Hartford, could it be anything other than the Whalers?
I think it’s funny that both teams named the Browns moved to Baltimore.
If a team would move to Hartford, could it be anything other than the Whalers?
I hope so. That team is gone. Start with something fresh! Just my opinion.
It’s one thing to say the Jets were “all that Winnipeg had”; it’s another to say it’s all they *can* have.
One NFL team, that wasn’t mentioned: Portsmouth Spartans becoming the Detroit Lions
Oh — good point! I’ll do a follow-up next week.
“That team is gone. Start with something fresh!”
Fair opinion, but it contradicts your thoughts on the Orioles and Brewers, who both had not just minor league teams named that, but also short lived AL teams with those names. Likewise the original AL Washington baseball team alternated between Senators and Nationals for a lot its history.
I can see both opinions here, as the new Jets don’t lay claim to the franchise history of original team now in Arizona. Much like the case of the Titans/Texans/Oilers, the Oilers name might not be used, but the franchise’s history is now in Tennessee. And even in the case of Browns who got to keep their identity and history, while the Ravens can’t lay claim to it, I cannot imagine Model and crew were forced to leave behind the (pre-SB) championship trophies and other physical parts of the franchise history of value that were theirs.
Promoting a minor league team to big-league status feels like a different animal. In those cases, it’s obviously a new team, a new era, a new franchise. Reviving an existing big league team name seems like a way of creating a false fantasy that the newly relocated team is just a continuation of the old departed team. That bugs me. (I hate, for example, the revisionist history of the new Browns supposedly being the same as the original Browns.)
Again, just my take. I realize there are other valid positions.
What’s the feeling if the A’s move to Las Vegas (or somewhere) ? I’d like them to keep the name bc it’s historic & has been used in multiple cities. (I didn’t read the article)
Selecting Jets for the return of the Winnipeg hockey team was the only way to go. Sure they could have picked another name but I’m sure that would have not gone over well. Not likely to have been more popular with the local market and fans north of the border.
Fans felt the team was stolen away in 1996. A small market taking in revenues with a weak Canadian dollar at the time as the NHL business was changing. A place where hockey belongs that was having the team ripped away from it.
Going with the name Jets was the return of the team fans were heartbroken about losing to circumstances beyond their control at the time.
It just felt right and they did put some effort into making the identity new. They did not just put the old logo on the chest and call it a day. They created a new logo inspired by the Royal Canadian Air Force. New uniforms and colour scheme.
Ironically, the current Jets relocated from Atlanta, which has now had two teams “stolen” from them. And Atlanta fans couldn’t even revive the Flames name because the team took it with them! (Interestingly, the original owners of the Thrashers maintained the ownership of the team name and branding when the franchise moved to Winnipeg.)
Obviously, these situations are messy and there are usually few if any perfect solutions. Fun topic to debate, for sure!
Agree completely. Imagine if this was written about the ‘new’ Browns in 1999:
Personally, I’ve always been disappointed that they just revived the old “Browns” name (originally used by the team that moved from Cleveland and became the Ravens, as discussed above). It’s not a terrible name, but it seems like a lazy fallback option. Why not come up with something new? Pfeh.
The team identities that were lost (Whalers, Nordiques, Supersonics, Oilers, Jets) meant something to the communities they were lost from.
Why not come up with something new? Because not everybody wants a fresh start. Getting your team back in’t just an opportunity to start fresh, its an opportunity to connect with a the history that was taken away.
Not one person in Cleveland in 1999 said “we need a fresh start”. Not one person in Winnipeg in 2011 said “we need a fresh start”.
If and when the Expos come back, nobody will be asking for a refresh. The refrain is “bring back the Expos”, not “bring back baseball”.
Personally, I’ve always been disappointed that they just revived the old “Browns” name (originally used by the team that moved from Cleveland and became the Ravens, as discussed above).
Actually, I was (and still am) disappointed that they revived the Browns name. The whole idea that the current Browns are just a continuation of the old Browns, complete with the records, stats, etc., is just revisionist history. I’ve never cared for it.
I realize reasonable people can differ, however!
I’d say the Browns were also somewhat different from other situations as part of them leaving included the award of a replacement franchise immediately (sort of like with the Washington Senators 2.0). These other franchises came back eventually, their return wasn’t preordained when they left.
I think, were the team “owned” somehow by the city or community, and say left because the city just can’t financially support them so another city then gets the chance to have one of the limited franchises. In that case it makes more sense to bring back the old name, to say it is still the same team. But that isn’t how it works.
Individuals actually own the franchises, they ultimately own the championships, etc. Relocating the team and said championships simply makes their time in the original location some sort of nebulous thing. Certainly Irsay can celebrate the Colts SB-V win, but nobody in Indianapolis really cares about that, meanwhile surely there are countless folks around Baltimore that have fond memories of that, even though they now support a different team. Had the Colts changed their name when they moved, and the current Baltimore team took up the Colts name again, they wouldn’t suddenly have that SB-V championship on display in the stadium, it would still be in Indianapolis.
I think Paul’s thoughts are a good realist perspective, when you lose your team they never really come back (LA Rams aside), the replacement team is 100% a new team, and the history of the team you lost is now some sort of shared thing that belongs to some other city that doesn’t even care about that history now. It is like the memory of a dog you lost. You can get a new dog, one that looks just like your old dog, you can even give it the same name, but of course it is not the original dog.
That’s a fair point. I appreciate that we can have a respectful discussion about this.
Your point on “the old Browns are not the new Browns” is a good one and I’m not sure how to deal with it. This only works because intellectual property is transferrable and sellable, and because (in the case of the Browns and Jets) the old intellectual property happened to be available – in the Jets case, because the Coyotes were owned by the league for a while.
I know this is a weird thing for a lawyer to say, but the technicalities don’t matter to me. If we want to get technical, the current St. Louis Blues franchise was founded in 1983 and it’s revisionist history to say they were founded in 1967. Whether its the Jets or the Browns (or the Blues) knowing its not the same franchise doesn’t matter to me.
Whether its the Jets or the Browns (or the Blues) knowing its not the same franchise doesn’t matter to me.
I totally get that many people feel that way. But I happen to feel differently! That’s why I went out of my way in the Bulletin article to mention Matt Stover and Ozzie Newsome remaining with the Ravens for so long (Newsome is still a VP there!). The Browns are still in that franchise’s DNA, which is a potent reminder that you can engage in all sorts of IP hocus-pocus but the reality is, you know, what it is, by which I mean that the Ravens are the original Browns, and the new Browns have nothing to do with the old Browns. Pretending otherwise bugs me, although I realize other people feel differently.
Mike 2’s comment about the Blues led me down a rabbit hole. I had no idea about what happened in 1983.
For anyone interested, I found a nice rundown here…. link
Shaftman – there’s another good summary here
link
The point to me for this discussion is that the NHL revoked the existing franchise and awarded a new one to Harry Ornest on July 27, 1983. The new one bought the assets of the old one (including the arena and the IP).
I know that similar hocus-pocus (to use Paul’s word) happened with the Sabres, Senators and Penguins who all went through an insolvency.
I’m not hung up on any of those discontinuities – the big difference between those examples and the Browns/Jets is that the Sabres, Senators, Penguins, Blues didn’t miss any seasons (thought the Blues did miss a draft).
I was going to college in Baltimore when the Colts slipped away in the middle of the night. I grew up a Washington fan so it didn’t hurt me the way it did some of my friends. Still, I feel like Baltimore got the fuzzy end of the lollipop both times: they didn’t get to keep the history and name when they lost the Colts, and they didn’t get inherit the Browns’ history when the team became the Ravens.
And Atlanta fans couldn’t even revive the Flames name because the team took it with them!
If there were more Atlanta hockey fans, they might still have a team.
You could say the exact same thing about every single market that a team has vacated.
And that’s my point — Winnipeg is not unique, and neither is any other city. The situation is always the same: The home fans think their team was “stolen,” and outside observers think the market didn’t provide enough support.
The most depressing relocation was NBA Seattle > Oklahoma City. The crowds for the Supersonics were as big as they ever were. The fans supported the team, but that didn’t stop Clay Bennett from pulling up the stakes and moving the team to his hometown. Short of an expansion team, Seattle has to hope for some other city’s misfortune.
That’s “Fiery” Ann Calvello wearing the offset 58 in the Roller Derby picture. She was one of the sports superstars in the 60’s, known for her quick temper and changing hair colors.
The pic of Calvello brought back great memories. Sunday morning roller derby on NYC’s channel 9 was must see TV in the late 60s. Calvello, Joanie Weston, Charlie O’Connel, Dynamite Tony Roman, Sugar Ray Robinson’s son Ronnie Robinson we’re household names, at least among pre-teen boys.
Oh, man — I wish I’d been old enough to see that!!
Yep. I watched Channel 9 telecasts every Sunday. The names still rattle around my brain. Mike Gammon, Margie Laszlo, Bill Groll, . . .
Just a quick note on your bulletin piece; the Baltimore Orioles team name existed in the major leagues for a bit prior to 1954 as well, not just as minor league teams. They were an AL team in 1901 and 1902, eventually relocating to New York and becoming the Yankees.
I was unaware of the history of the Chiefs name until this article. Curious Paul, given that history, if the Chiefs dumped the arrowhead logo, and perhaps simply had the interlocking KC on the helmet, would you find that acceptable?
That would certainly be better than the current situation. But it seems like trying to split the difference instead of making meaningful change. I’d rather see them change the name.
The Chiefs connection to Bartle is certainly an interesting one, and I agree, folks often use it to lessen or justify the connection to the Native American issue. I would agree as a KC area resident, the team is somewhat walking a tightrope at the moment: holding onto the name and arrowhead logo (this isn’t unique, but I can confirm fans will crap a brick if a name change is proposed), while minimizing the obviously problematic stuff.
Side note: my Eagle Scout son and I are both members of Mic-O-Say from our time in Scouting years ago, and I will say the organization is both great and IMHO concerning at the same time. From first hand knowledge and experience, I can say confidently the program is wonderful for leadership development and the Scouts’ overall growth and experience. I always found the Native American lore and education included with the program to be respectful and honorific (that doesn’t mean it’s appropriate, and I’m not saying it is, just my two cents about its presentation). On the other hand, from the start, I was uncomfortable watching primarily middle-aged, white adults and their sons dress in Native American garb and taking part in pseudo ceremonial activities. Interestingly, the national Scouting honor society, Order of the Arrow, dropped a good portion of its Native American references, and from my perspective, it ultimately lessened the program’s effectiveness. Again, not a reason to stop evaluating and changing such things, just a few thoughts about how complicated some of this can be.
As an OA member (albeit one who is 42 and uninvolved with scouting for more than 20 years) I’m interested to hear why you think that it has lost effectiveness by dropping some/most of its native iconography. In my experience, very little of what was meaningful for me was in that iconography. I took much more from the service leadership I was encouraged to participate in, but recognize that mileage probably varies widely by lodge.
Sure, mileage may vary, but I think what I saw, particularly in the boys, is that there was sort of a mystical/dramatic, dare I say spiritual quality that sort of accompanied the Native American iconography. I realize not all were taken by such things. I think part of it is that in comparison, Mic-O-Say, largely because of the Native American lore stuff, strikes the boys as more serious, if you will, than OA, which comes off as somewhat sanitized. Not saying what’s been changed is bad at all, and there are most certainly other ways to get the points across without the troublesome iconography. It may be somewhat unique to this area, where you have both leadership orgs working at the same time, among the same folks, so the differences are pretty striking. In other parts of the country, OA is all there is, so one wouldn’t know the differences.
I don’t want to change the subject, but I think that the importance of Native American imagery for groups like the boy scouts is indeed spiritual, in the broadest sense. America has very little mythology which undergirds our self-understanding, and what we have is problematic (revolution, Native American bravery, new Rome, manifest destiny, leader of the first world, etc.). So, in order to pass on meaningful virtue to the next generation, we have to take up language which is not properly our own in order to make it desirable and understandable. Probably why your experience with OA seems “sanitized.”
Great insight. I’m not familiar with the scouting part at all. If I am understanding what you are saying, you think all the Native American parts are done respectfully, but that they are taught by non-Natives that make it uncomfortable/problematic to you? That if they actually brought in Natives to the group to share that history on their own it would make it more, genuine?
I suppose that would make it less uncomfortable for me, personally, yes. That said, just because those representing the program are not Native Americans, that doesn’t mean they don’t have a right to teach what they are teaching, etc. I think the concepts taught are worthwhile, regardless of who is doing the teaching. My issue was always with a group of largely suburban Caucasians dressing in Native American outfits, using such vernacular in ceremony and dancing around a fire to drum beats never felt appropriate to me. So sure, that part isn’t what I would consider authentic or particularly genuine. I will say that I was open about not being comfortable taking part in what I’ll call the “dress up” parts, and there’s no such requirement. However, most do. No one ever made me feel like I was doing anything wrong by not taking part in those aspects of it, to their credit.
Re your original question about the Chiefs, they could drop the arrowhead and replace it with a fireman’s helmet with a “KC” and leave it Chiefs (as in fire chiefs), yes?
Right, that all makes sense. Given they are not just teaching history, but actively demonstrating aspects of the culture. And given the history of how Natives have been treated, its a murky thing. No matter how respectful they are in doing it, and how genuinely well intended they are, and how good it is to learn about, it is going seem off.
I agree it is great that 1) the kids are learning that history and culture, and 2) learn aspects of that culture that promote and develop traits that will make them good citizens and human beings. So based on that I would hope, regardless of the awkwardness of who is teaching, the program continues. It is never bad to learn about other cultures, learn important truthful history, and learn how to be a good leader.
Love love love those 70s MLB posters! Also, ‘Jersey Combo’…hilarious.
These posters were part of a Wheaties promotion back in the day. I had the O’s and my brother the Cardinals. Probably cost all of a buck and a couple of boxtops.
I love those posters too. Some real beauties in there. Only one really lacking– the Yankees poster. The blue on their uniforms is WAY too light!
Shoutout to Ticker submitter “Carl Hungus.” Gonna go watch Logjammin’ now.
“The Avs’ (ЯR) version, e.g., will reportedly be based on the old Colorado Rockies…”
Please, no.
Just once, I’d love to see the Devils do something like that.
The Avalanche should wear these on occasion…or forever!:
link
Throwback uniforms for relocated franchises only make sense in certain locations: For example, Devils playing as Rockies in Denver against Avalanche, or Dallas playing as North Stars in Minnesota against the Wild. For this reason, Both sets of uniforms should be paid for by the home team as in baseball.
Obviously, not all conditions are equal. Québec City fans are deeply bitter about losing the Nords, so putting the Avs in Québec uniforms to play Montréal would be in terribly bad taste.
The roller derby photo is Jerry Seltzer the owner and Ann Calvello
I absolutely love the NFL illustration, except it bugs me that the bass is smaller than the guitar, lol.
LOL, music nerd alert!. Love that illustration too, but you are correct. Also, that drummer’s form is off. Probably because he’s holding his sticks with hoofs! How’s he doing that?
Short scale Fender Mustang bass might explain the size?
From Bulletin, “It’s also unpleasant to pronounce, because of the double “th” sound — ”the Thunder.””
Technically not true. Although both the and Thunder start with the letters “th”, they are pronounced differently. In “the”, your vocal chords vibrate whereas in “Thunder” they do not vibrate. Put your fingers in your throat when you say them to check for yourself.
Yes, the name is trash and yes, the two sounds are very similar. But no, the sounds are not identical.
Put your fingers ON your throat. Please don’t choke yourself by putting your fingers IN your throat.
“Dallas Stars” never sounded right to me, it’s hard to introduce the pronunciation break between the two words. One team where “Stars of Dallas” would be an improvement.
Edgar Allan Poe not Edgar Allen Poe.
Ooooh, great catch! Will fix.
Didn’t the NHL Rangers (estd. 1926) have any input into the naming of the MLB Rangers (estd. 1972)? At the very least, the baseball team should pay the hockey team some money.
That Rams/49ers picture from 1957 caused me to look up Hy Peskin (the photographer). If you go to Getty Images and look up the Hy Peskin Collection, there’s over 7000 images there from him. A couple which are Uni-Watch “cool”. The whole collection is a big bit of awesomeness…
From 1960, a wide shot of all the Little League World Series teams
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From 1956, the Cincinnati Redlegs collective photo, showing Ted “The Big Klu” Kluszewski and his cutoff sleeves
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From the 1957 Rams/49ers game, another #9, backup QB Billy Wade (note the starter in that game was #11, Norm Van Brocklin)
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Great stuff, Tim. I’ll investigate Peskin further!
Didn’t you have a story about Hy Peskin years ago?
Yes! Three entries, in fact, 11 years ago. I had completely forgotten. (Sometimes the old blog entries become a blur.) Thanks so much for remembering!
Here:
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link
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Unfortunately, the photo links no longer work.
Looks like Peskin’s estate may have pushed a good number of those photos into Getty. Quite the variety of sport. Football, baseball, basketball, boxing, auto racing…even some pin-ups…
He’s got a legacy website that have a number of the photos from Getty as well.
link
I think I may have read the articles out of order, but anyway I always thought “BROOKLYN BALLERS” would’ve been a solid re-name.
I grew up in NY & this reminded me of the NJ NETS really quirky logo. It showed a basketball dropping through a hoop…..that had no net!
Regarding the Texas Rangers, and again leaving the culture wars stuff out, IMO it’s a great-sounding name and great-looking logo with the hat. I think you kind of cherry-picked dumb sounding law enforcement agency names to make your point, but I could just as easily counter with Vancouver Mounties, another team named for a law enforcement agency that works well.
Well, the New York Rangers were named because GI “Tex” Rickard who created the second NHL Team in NY (at that time there were the NY Americans) had Conn Smythe signing experienced players. Sportswriters were referring to this group of players as “Tex’s Rangers” and the name stuck. link
So if anyone owes anyone anything, the NY Rangers owe the Texas Rangers (the Law enforcement group, not the Baseball team) money.
I loved the MN Wild’s R.R. jersey. “North Stars” Wild was an awesome one. In a similar vein to the team identity move topic, I wish that the local community could keep a team’s identity for throwback purposes even if they lost the team previously. I wish the Wild could wear North Stars throwback. I definitely want the Timberwolves to wear throwback MPLS baby blue Lakers jerseys.
As was mentioned by many above, I know people can have a variety of opinions. Even if LA gets to keep the name Lakers, it would be awesome to see the Wolves wear blue MPLS uniforms against the current Lakers.
From the first Soccer ticker item, I believe the first team listed is actually called the HEARTS of Midllothian. I may be wrong, but that’s how I’ve heard them refered as watchin on the telly.
The full team name is singular — Heart of Midllothian FC. But the common shorthand is to refer to them as “Hearts.”
(Confused by that? Me too!)
See Colorado Avalanche,commonly called Avs…
There’s some debate as to whether or not the Phillies are a relocated team (Worcester, MA…the Brown Stockings or Ruby Legs?).
I still say the wrong team left town.
The Brown Stockings were disbanded after the 1882 season by the National League, which was facing competition from the upstart American Association and was looking to reorganize. The vacant Worcester franchise was picked up by sporting goods mogul Al Reach, who started the Philadelphia Phillies in 1883, though it had none of the same players or personnel. Yet the Philadelphia Phillies still claim their heritage from the Worcester Brown Stockings. (From link)
However, as a lifelong Phillies fan, I’ve never heard the Phillies ever make any reference to Worcester.